Memory Stick Reliability Issue

[Gene Wirchenko]

Dear SQLers:

I have two systems: an XP system which is my main system and a
Windows 7 system which is for development. The latter is a
sacrificial goat which might get sacrificed yet and rebuilt.

Microsoft makes it rather difficult to tell which versions of SQL
Server 2008 Express one needs. They have many versions ranging from
just under 100 MB to just under 1 GB. I have downloaded several
gigabytes of them.

I download them to my XP system. Anything that I want on my 7
system, I copy to a memory stick and from there to the 7 system.

It does not always work! I have gotten messages about corrupt
SQL Server installation files. This does not happen often, and there
is not much corruption. It is an occasional few (usually four) bytes
in a sector. This behaviour seems to happen only with large files.

From now on, I will be checking both copy results. If you are
having any weirdness in your installs, this might be part of it.

Between the above and installation programs that throw exceptions
or just plain die, SQL Server Express is a rather challenging program
to install. Oh, I forgot about how my XP system got hosed a while
back by SSE installation and I had to have Windows reloaded. That,
too.

Sincerely,

Gene Wirchenko

[Jeroen Mostert]

Post by Gene Wirchenko
Microsoft makes it rather difficult to tell which versions of SQL
Server 2008 Express one needs. They have many versions ranging from
just under 100 MB to just under 1 GB. I have downloaded several
gigabytes of them.

That's because the Express versions are offered with service packs included
(and there have been three), 2008 still has a 32-bit version as well, and
Express is offered with and without desktop tooling.

I'd download SQL Server 2008 Express with Tools
(http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/download/details.aspx?id=22973) and Service
Pack 3 (http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/download/details.aspx?id=27594).

Post by Gene Wirchenko
I download them to my XP system. Anything that I want on my 7
system, I copy to a memory stick and from there to the 7 system.

If only there was some way to have computers exchange data without using
storage media. A sort of "network", if you will. :-)

Seriously, though, if you think you'll be doing this more often, a simple
switch costs nothing these days and offers better throughput and reliability
than a USB stick.

OK, I checked -- it's not actually nothing, it's $12. Well then.

Post by Gene Wirchenko
It does not always work! I have gotten messages about corrupt
SQL Server installation files. This does not happen often, and there
is not much corruption. It is an occasional few (usually four) bytes
in a sector. This behaviour seems to happen only with large files.

I've had far worse luck getting the downloads from Microsoft in an
uncorrupted state to begin with. This is compounded by the fact that they
usually don't publish checksums for the files, except for some of the larger
images. Even then I need wget to make sure the downloads complete at all.

Post by Gene Wirchenko
Between the above and installation programs that throw exceptions
or just plain die, SQL Server Express is a rather challenging program
to install. Oh, I forgot about how my XP system got hosed a while
back by SSE installation and I had to have Windows reloaded. That,
too.

Thanks for sharing your experiences, I guess? Not sure what other people are
supposed to take away from it.

[Gene Wirchenko]

On Wed, 09 May 2012 20:44:18 +0200, Jeroen Mostert

Post by Jeroen Mostert

Post by Gene Wirchenko
Microsoft makes it rather difficult to tell which versions of SQL
Server 2008 Express one needs. They have many versions ranging from
just under 100 MB to just under 1 GB. I have downloaded several
gigabytes of them.

That's because the Express versions are offered with service packs included
(and there have been three), 2008 still has a 32-bit version as well, and
Express is offered with and without desktop tooling.

There are a lot of them, and few have version numbers in the
filenames, and some of them are different yet have the same filename.

Post by Jeroen Mostert
I'd download SQL Server 2008 Express with Tools
(http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/download/details.aspx?id=22973) and Service
Pack 3 (http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/download/details.aspx?id=27594).

Post by Gene Wirchenko
I download them to my XP system. Anything that I want on my 7
system, I copy to a memory stick and from there to the 7 system.

If only there was some way to have computers exchange data without using
storage media. A sort of "network", if you will. :-)

Sure. I could easily connect the two of them. They are already
connected to the same router. A bit of software configuration and my
7 system will able to trash my main system! That is not something I
want. I prefer the separation.

Post by Jeroen Mostert
Seriously, though, if you think you'll be doing this more often, a simple
switch costs nothing these days and offers better throughput and reliability
than a USB stick.
OK, I checked -- it's not actually nothing, it's $12. Well then.

I do not want a connection between the two systems.

Post by Jeroen Mostert

Post by Gene Wirchenko
It does not always work! I have gotten messages about corrupt
SQL Server installation files. This does not happen often, and there
is not much corruption. It is an occasional few (usually four) bytes
in a sector. This behaviour seems to happen only with large files.

I've had far worse luck getting the downloads from Microsoft in an
uncorrupted state to begin with. This is compounded by the fact that they
usually don't publish checksums for the files, except for some of the larger
images. Even then I need wget to make sure the downloads complete at all.

I am not referring to downloads not working although Firefox does
not allow me to interrupt a download and then resume it. It always
fails on the resume.

I am referring to the copy to the memory stick being bad.

Post by Jeroen Mostert

Post by Gene Wirchenko
Between the above and installation programs that throw exceptions
or just plain die, SQL Server Express is a rather challenging program
to install. Oh, I forgot about how my XP system got hosed a while
back by SSE installation and I had to have Windows reloaded. That,
too.

Thanks for sharing your experiences, I guess? Not sure what other people are
supposed to take away from it.

Well, you could try reading what I wrote. I have a memory stick
that does not work so reliably on large files. SQL Server
installation files are large files.

Sincerely,

Gene Wirchenko

[Jeroen Mostert]

Post by Gene Wirchenko
On Wed, 09 May 2012 20:44:18 +0200, Jeroen Mostert

<snip>

Post by Gene Wirchenko

Post by Jeroen Mostert

Post by Gene Wirchenko
I download them to my XP system. Anything that I want on my 7
system, I copy to a memory stick and from there to the 7 system.

If only there was some way to have computers exchange data without using
storage media. A sort of "network", if you will. :-)

Sure. I could easily connect the two of them. They are already
connected to the same router. A bit of software configuration and my
7 system will able to trash my main system! That is not something I
want. I prefer the separation.

Then don't shuttle executable data between them?

I do get your point, but this seems either overly paranoid or not paranoid
enough. I would have to stop and think to "trash" one system with another
over a network connection. I wouldn't be worried about this happening
spontaneously. I'd think disconnecting after the copy is sufficient -- this
is no more dangerous than ferrying in code from the Internet in the first place.

Post by Gene Wirchenko

Post by Jeroen Mostert
Thanks for sharing your experiences, I guess? Not sure what other people are
supposed to take away from it.

Well, you could try reading what I wrote. I have a memory stick
that does not work so reliably on large files. SQL Server
installation files are large files.

There are a Windows XP machine and a memory stick in existence that together
seem to corrupt large files. Check. I did indeed not know that. People who
want to replicate your exact scenario without corruption should... I don't
know, use DVD-Rs instead, I suppose.

You can relax now, I'm just teasing you. :-) Maybe this will indeed be of
use to someone, how should I know.

[Gene Wirchenko]

On Wed, 09 May 2012 22:18:04 +0200, Jeroen Mostert

Post by Jeroen Mostert

Post by Gene Wirchenko
On Wed, 09 May 2012 20:44:18 +0200, Jeroen Mostert

<snip>

Post by Gene Wirchenko

Post by Jeroen Mostert

Post by Gene Wirchenko
I download them to my XP system. Anything that I want on my 7
system, I copy to a memory stick and from there to the 7 system.

If only there was some way to have computers exchange data without using
storage media. A sort of "network", if you will. :-)

Sure. I could easily connect the two of them. They are already
connected to the same router. A bit of software configuration and my
7 system will able to trash my main system! That is not something I
want. I prefer the separation.

Then don't shuttle executable data between them?

No, that would not prevent me from a typing error hitting the
wrong drive and targetting the wrong system.

Post by Jeroen Mostert
I do get your point, but this seems either overly paranoid or not paranoid
enough. I would have to stop and think to "trash" one system with another
over a network connection. I wouldn't be worried about this happening
spontaneously. I'd think disconnecting after the copy is sufficient -- this
is no more dangerous than ferrying in code from the Internet in the first place.

I do not want to have to connect, etc. Mounting a memory stick
is simple.

[snip]

Post by Jeroen Mostert
There are a Windows XP machine and a memory stick in existence that together
seem to corrupt large files. Check. I did indeed not know that. People who
want to replicate your exact scenario without corruption should... I don't
know, use DVD-Rs instead, I suppose.
You can relax now, I'm just teasing you. :-) Maybe this will indeed be of
use to someone, how should I know.

Well, given the amount of trouble I have had with SQL Server
installations and that others have had troubles, too, this is a
heads-up for them.

Sincerely,

Gene Wirchenko

[Tony Toews]

Post by Gene Wirchenko
I have two systems: an XP system which is my main system and a
Windows 7 system which is for development. The latter is a
sacrificial goat which might get sacrificed yet and rebuilt.

Consider using Virtual PC or Virtual Box for such sacrificial OSs. So
long as the host PC has lots of RAM. If you use an USB attached
external hard drive (and at least a dual core PC although I don't
think you could find a single core PC these days) you won't even
notice the OS startup and shutdown. I have every version of Windows
since 2000 on that external hard drive.

Post by Gene Wirchenko
I download them to my XP system. Anything that I want on my 7
system, I copy to a memory stick and from there to the 7 system.
It does not always work! I have gotten messages about corrupt
SQL Server installation files. This does not happen often, and there
is not much corruption. It is an occasional few (usually four) bytes
in a sector. This behaviour seems to happen only with large files.

Do you copy from the memory stick to the hard drive and then do the
install? Or install from the memory stick? Memory sticks don't seem
to do well with lots of different reads like an install would do.
But that's very subjective on my part.

Tony

[Gene Wirchenko]

On Wed, 09 May 2012 13:59:45 -0600, Tony Toews

Post by Tony Toews

Post by Gene Wirchenko
I have two systems: an XP system which is my main system and a
Windows 7 system which is for development. The latter is a
sacrificial goat which might get sacrificed yet and rebuilt.

Consider using Virtual PC or Virtual Box for such sacrificial OSs. So
long as the host PC has lots of RAM. If you use an USB attached
external hard drive (and at least a dual core PC although I don't
think you could find a single core PC these days) you won't even
notice the OS startup and shutdown. I have every version of Windows
since 2000 on that external hard drive.

Not enough RAM on my XP system. I needed another computer
anyway. Not using such is simpler. Maybe I will give it a try if my
7 system ever becomes my main system.

[snip]

Post by Tony Toews
Do you copy from the memory stick to the hard drive and then do the
install? Or install from the memory stick? Memory sticks don't seem
to do well with lots of different reads like an install would do.
But that's very subjective on my part.

I copy to the hard drive of the 7 system and install from the
hard drive. The slowness that I have seen with memory sticks has been
with writes. That may have been a different USB version as it was
some years ago.

Sincerely,

Gene Wirchenko

[Tony Toews]

Post by Gene Wirchenko
Not enough RAM on my XP system. I needed another computer
anyway. Not using such is simpler. Maybe I will give it a try if my
7 system ever becomes my main system.

FWIW I've been using a 4 Gb or recently an 8 Gb laptop as my
programming system and Virtual PC/Virtual Box server for at least 5 or
7 years now.

But when I travel I need to ensure I take my programming system with
me so I can take care of problems while on the road.

Tony

[Philipp Post]

I usually test my memory sticks with a software called H2TESTW if I
have doubt if they are still good.
http://translate.google.ca/translate?hl=en&sl=de&u=http://www.heise.de/software/download/h2testw/50539&sa=X&oi=translate&resnum=2&ct=result&prev=/search%3Fq%3DH2testw%26hl%3Den%26sa%3DG

It writes the USB stick full of test data, tries to read them and
reports in case of error. If that is the case you will need to get a
new one.

Then, on a FAT32 formatted stick (what is the default), the maximum
file size is 4 GB for one file.

brgds
Philipp Post